Richard Anthony & Kat McCann Podcast Transcript.
Rich
Hey, Kat, thanks so much for coming on the Rich Mix on our second podcast of our series. And hope all is well. How you been going and happy new year.
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Kat McCann
Yeah, look, happy new year to you too. And thank you so much for having me. All is really good, bit rainy, but good up here. Thank you.
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Rich
Yeah, awesome. And you're based in Brizzy, yeah?
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Kat McCann
Yep, that's right.
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Rich
Fantastic. So I just want to go through like a little bit of a intro a little bit about yourself so can you share a little bit about your journey in the Cosmetic tattooing industry on how you got into it and why you wanted to do it in the first place
.
Kat McCann
Okay, so started probably makeup artists, nail, nail tech, self taught, probably maybe 15 plus years ago. You know, I used to work in nightclubs. As I was growing up, like job wise, so you kind of got creative and you were able to sort of just, you know, make stuff up and do things. And then I suppose that then progress, I found it really fun. Everything has to be fun. And then yeah, so I ended up deciding one day randomly, I just want to open a shop. And yeah, it was as simple as that. There was no sort of set strategic plan to go, yes, this is what I want to do and I'm going to map it all out. And it just happened to be fun. And I was like, I better, you know, I better formalize my quolls. So I did a diploma in beauty and then I kind of progressed from there. And yeah, everything just kind of evolved. So that was it.
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Rich
What services were you offering when you first opened?
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Kat McCann
Oh, um, when I first opened, so it was basic beauty. So obviously nails, beauty massage, spray tans, all of those sorts of things, brow wax and tints, like stuff. Uh, and then obviously over the year. Yeah. So I built my first, yeah, my first salon. Um, gosh, it was like 105 square meters, like five treatment rooms. Like I went big straight up. I had no idea what I was doing. Um, but, um, I actually, actually ended up building a big play tech kids play center in the other half of it and hired a yeah like a kid looker after or whatever they're called a daycare worker and yeah so every everything that I do is just a little bit a little bit different
.
Rich
Hey, Kat, thanks so much for coming on the Rich Mix on our second podcast of our series. And hope all is well. How you been going and happy new year.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, look, happy new year to you too. And thank you so much for having me. All is really good, bit rainy, but good up here. Thank you.
.
Rich
Yeah, awesome. And you're based in Brizzy, yeah?
.
Kat McCann
Yep, that's right.
.
Rich
Fantastic. So I just want to go through like a little bit of a intro a little bit about yourself so can you share a little bit about your journey in the Cosmetic tattooing industry on how you got into it and why you wanted to do it in the first place
.
Kat McCann
Okay, so started probably makeup artists, nail, nail tech, self taught, probably maybe 15 plus years ago. You know, I used to work in nightclubs. As I was growing up, like job wise, so you kind of got creative and you were able to sort of just, you know, make stuff up and do things. And then I suppose that then progress, I found it really fun. Everything has to be fun. And then yeah, so I ended up deciding one day randomly, I just want to open a shop. And yeah, it was as simple as that. There was no sort of set strategic plan to go, yes, this is what I want to do and I'm going to map it all out. And it just happened to be fun. And I was like, I better, you know, I better formalize my quolls. So I did a diploma in beauty and then I kind of progressed from there. And yeah, everything just kind of evolved. So that was it.
.
Rich
What services were you offering when you first opened?
.
Kat McCann
Oh, um, when I first opened, so it was basic beauty. So obviously nails, beauty massage, spray tans, all of those sorts of things, brow wax and tints, like stuff. Uh, and then obviously over the year. Yeah. So I built my first, yeah, my first salon. Um, gosh, it was like 105 square meters, like five treatment rooms. Like I went big straight up. I had no idea what I was doing. Um, but, um, I actually, actually ended up building a big play tech kids play center in the other half of it and hired a yeah like a kid looker after or whatever they're called a daycare worker and yeah so every everything that I do is just a little bit a little bit different
.
Rich
Oh yeah, awesome. But that's cool, because then the mums can come, bring their kids, the kids get looked after while they're getting some treatments for the day, and they'll spend more money because they've got more time.
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Kat McCann
And that's it. And the whole idea is you just disconnect and you can have a little bit of time for yourself. But yeah.
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Rich
Yeah, enough. And so then what inspired you then to get into the cosmetic tattooing?
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Kat McCann
Kat McCann
And that's it. And the whole idea is you just disconnect and you can have a little bit of time for yourself. But yeah.
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Rich
Yeah, enough. And so then what inspired you then to get into the cosmetic tattooing?
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Kat McCann
Um, I suppose fast forward, um, I, I tend to do lots of different things all at the same time. So between having salons and then obviously we incorporated hair and beauty. So that was sort of a bit of a hair and beauty collective and built a couple more. So, you know, multiple, multiple salons across multiple locations with, you know, teams and things like that. Um, I, the tattooing side came a lot, a lot further down the track. Like I'd, you know, worked between corporate and clinics. I was, you know, working as a journal. I worked as. I've worked at the universities, I've got a couple of degrees and stuff. So I do some serious stuff on the other side, HR and all that kind of stuff. And then being able to incorporate those skills and then apply them to clinic or obviously different industry related things. So everything's an evolution. But at the end of the day, for me, if it's not fun, I just don't do it. I get too bored and then I want to do something else. Yeah.
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Rich
Yeah, yeah. And so it was an easy transition because you're already a beauty therapist, you understand a lot of the main fundamentals and all that kind of stuff. So it was more about just levelling up your skills and yeah, be able to offer a different service with a more high value ticket kind of offers. Yeah.
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Kat McCann
I think, yeah, and I think too, like for me, I was working at the university, it was really serious, I was teaching and you know, we were doing sort of advisory stuff at the uni and then I got pregnant with my son so when it came time to obviously have him, I needed the flexibility of that work-life balance and I knew that obviously, you know, returning to the uni, I wasn't going to be able to get that, well not to the extent that I needed it and then I also sort of thought about tattooing. It had been obviously something that I'd seen and I was like, oh, that looks really cool. And then, you know, investigated sort of what that looks like. So while I was pregnant, I actually investigated, looking at doing cosmetic tattoo training, obviously. And at the time it was really hard. Like you sort of Googled it and there was some options, some were accredited, some were not. And it was very difficult at the time to sort of find some information around, you know, what was and
.
Rich
Yeah, yeah. And so it was an easy transition because you're already a beauty therapist, you understand a lot of the main fundamentals and all that kind of stuff. So it was more about just levelling up your skills and yeah, be able to offer a different service with a more high value ticket kind of offers. Yeah.
.
Kat McCann
I think, yeah, and I think too, like for me, I was working at the university, it was really serious, I was teaching and you know, we were doing sort of advisory stuff at the uni and then I got pregnant with my son so when it came time to obviously have him, I needed the flexibility of that work-life balance and I knew that obviously, you know, returning to the uni, I wasn't going to be able to get that, well not to the extent that I needed it and then I also sort of thought about tattooing. It had been obviously something that I'd seen and I was like, oh, that looks really cool. And then, you know, investigated sort of what that looks like. So while I was pregnant, I actually investigated, looking at doing cosmetic tattoo training, obviously. And at the time it was really hard. Like you sort of Googled it and there was some options, some were accredited, some were not. And it was very difficult at the time to sort of find some information around, you know, what was and
wasn't.
.
Rich
So when did you actually make that decision to start cosmetic tattooing?
Kat McCann
Okay, so decision I suppose came about like I'd seen it, I had seen it, there was a few of my friends that were sort of doing that and I guess I looked into it and I sort of thought I'll look, you know, I was pregnant with my son and I was sort of looking for something. I knew that if I went back into clinic work then obviously I'd have a lot more flexibility and so, and I suppose one of the good things like obviously looking into it, I knew that it would take time and like most you know, have those sort of fine motor skills. But, you know, I suppose at the same time, I had the flexibility at that stage where I was able to not have to work. So I didn't have that massive amount of pressure. I had to learn the skill. I had to go and get good at the skill and then obviously run a business at the same time. So I feel like that was probably one of the things that attracted me to it. But like, I guess in the past, yeah, in the past, I was because I worked as a mortian where we're putting this lady back together after an autopsy and she was like so beautiful. And I remember thinking, wow, you know, your face looks so nice. You kind of, you know, you're deceased, unfortunately. And she just looked so fresh and beautiful. And I thought, what a waste. So that was, I suppose, the first time I looked at it and thought, you know, the work or the level of sort of detail in her face. Yeah, I just I just felt that was a waste. And if I was able to do something like that, at least it was on living people where they could actually appreciate it.
.
Rich
And that was you doing makeup on them pretty much at that time before...
.
Kat McCann
No, no, no. At that stage at the mortuary we're doing embalming. So basically it's like, yeah, putting people back together after autopsies and body prescriptions. Yeah, that was fun. So, you know, the things that you kind of need that attention to detail, I suppose it comes in many forms, right?
.
Rich
Yeah, wow. Yeah, yeah. Amazing, my God, so interesting.Yeah, yeah, definitely. And that I think that abarming smell is pretty strong. Cause I remember years ago when I did my apprenticeship, I did at New South Wales uni and our workshop was under the biomedical building. And right there, they had a morgue. And every time I'd walk past the morgue, there was the morgue attendant. He looked like a morgue attendant. He just had looked at you with open eyes, never blinked. And I remember stopping once and said,
.
Kat McCann
Yes.
.
Rich
Um, you know, how do you have any challenges? I don't know how you even do this job. Do you have anything that really, you know, that freaks you out about it? Because the only thing I hate is when people have got, uh, pins in their legs and then I've got to go through the bandsaw and I'm adding their legs up, you know? It's like, oh my God, but yeah, it's pretty crazy. But that smell was shocking. Um, but yeah, I can imagine. So that would have been really interesting. And then you started cosmetic tattooing and, um, and then you've been doing this now for many years, what have been some of the changes in the industry that you've seen that has been a big standout?
Kat McCann
I think, like, over the time, I suppose, I think, obviously, COVID was obviously a game changer in terms of, you know, education and delivery of content and information and that sort of real, I suppose, that connectivity of the industry. So you saw the exploding of online, on forums, on, you know, in like face to face, but on online education, I think that that was probably the biggest thing. So I suppose that really shifted that paragon in terms of that. And I think the fact that everyone was so connected and had all this time that they spent a lot more of it on online and connecting in those different ways. So that was certainly probably a big shift. And then that access to information and obviously conversations in forums and things about stuff that I suppose was not. or was safeguarded or wasn't necessarily spoken about as much until that kind of happened. So that was probably number one. And yeah, I would say that would probably be the biggest in terms of the way that people connected.
.
Rich
And even then, like since then, that's when we had the massive technology swing with regards to online training from COVID. So then a lot of people use that time to create more online content. So then more workshops are coming up online. And if you know, the more cosmetic tattoos are popping up and with bugger or training, and then now they're becoming trainers. And yeah, so it's been a massive explosion in the industry, but there's still the rock solid people that have been doing it for years have got loyal clientele and they're building their clientele from their work, you know, because their work speaks for themselves. So, oh, that's fantastic. And so how do you stay ahead of the trends in such like a dynamic field like Cosmic Tattooing?
Kat McCann
I suppose, like, I probably do things in a roundabout, back, backward, upside down way. But I mean, for me, I don't, I really don't do a lot of social media. I don't follow what people are doing. So in a sense that, you know, If I'm interested in something or if there's an appeal of something, it's usually got sort of like an educational context or an underpinning as to, you know, why I want to understand it. So I stay across a lot of the forums and I just sort of watch a lot. I don't necessarily contribute that much anymore. And it's not for any other reason other than, you know, just I suppose time. But in terms of staying ahead, I really I love all aspects of business. And I think, you know, when it comes to sort of tattooing or even running a tattooing business or evolving within an industry, one, you have to stay across all the different facets that impact that industry. But then there's also the external sort of ripples, I suppose, that then contribute to those factors. And so from a business perspective, business and strategy and governance and all that sort of stuff, which is kind of where I suppose my passion really sits, that's the stuff that sort of political or that geopolitical environment that it just opens up so many different avenues to be able to then cross that across into permanent makeup. And then you can really sort of explore those areas for me. That would probably be where I feel my progression would come. So yeah, not necessarily hands-on, but bigger, wider, you know, help other people's side of things. Yeah.
.
Rich
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you obviously specialize in corrections is your thing, your jam. So that's where you're really well known for. So that can be a lot of challenges to that and fixing other people's work, you know? Without mentioning any names or anything like that, well, people recommend it, recommend their own clients to you, you know? So, which is awesome where, you know, you've got other people other cosmetic tattooists recommending you to help them out, you know, which I think is really good.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, sorry. I was just gonna say on that basis, too, on that recommendation, I think it's really, it's such a valuable, I suppose, situation where people, you know, they do feel safe enough to reach out and feel like they can actually, you know, ask for assistance and not be judged or have that sort of ability to connect. Leverage off that connection to sort of say, oh look, I'm stuck or I've had this happen or anything like that. And then we're actually able to then sort of assist and transition through those sorts of things. Corrections are hard and client management is hard and all those things are all hard.
.
Rich
Yeah, that's fantastic. Now, and I understand something exciting, like you've won numerous awards. And so tell me when that first award you won. Tell me about it. And how did that impact you? How did you feel about it?
.
Kat McCan
I think every single time you go in for an award or at least you even put together a submission for an award, it's always scary because you're basically, you're really vulnerable, you're putting yourself out there. And a lot of the, like the types of awards that I've entered, I try to make sure that I can stay diverse in terms of not applying for the same awards all the time. I really, I loved the concept that it was open merit. It was judged by multiple different. So the first one probably 2017. And yeah, that was that was, you know, I suppose it was just a, you know, it was a it was a big warm hug in a sense that you think, oh gosh, you, you are by yourself a lot of the time. So to have that recognition, have that acknowledgement is huge. But yeah, scary at the same time, because you're like I said, you're putting yourself out there, but it also affirms that you can.
So when did you actually make that decision to start cosmetic tattooing?
Kat McCann
Okay, so decision I suppose came about like I'd seen it, I had seen it, there was a few of my friends that were sort of doing that and I guess I looked into it and I sort of thought I'll look, you know, I was pregnant with my son and I was sort of looking for something. I knew that if I went back into clinic work then obviously I'd have a lot more flexibility and so, and I suppose one of the good things like obviously looking into it, I knew that it would take time and like most you know, have those sort of fine motor skills. But, you know, I suppose at the same time, I had the flexibility at that stage where I was able to not have to work. So I didn't have that massive amount of pressure. I had to learn the skill. I had to go and get good at the skill and then obviously run a business at the same time. So I feel like that was probably one of the things that attracted me to it. But like, I guess in the past, yeah, in the past, I was because I worked as a mortian where we're putting this lady back together after an autopsy and she was like so beautiful. And I remember thinking, wow, you know, your face looks so nice. You kind of, you know, you're deceased, unfortunately. And she just looked so fresh and beautiful. And I thought, what a waste. So that was, I suppose, the first time I looked at it and thought, you know, the work or the level of sort of detail in her face. Yeah, I just I just felt that was a waste. And if I was able to do something like that, at least it was on living people where they could actually appreciate it.
.
Rich
And that was you doing makeup on them pretty much at that time before...
.
Kat McCann
No, no, no. At that stage at the mortuary we're doing embalming. So basically it's like, yeah, putting people back together after autopsies and body prescriptions. Yeah, that was fun. So, you know, the things that you kind of need that attention to detail, I suppose it comes in many forms, right?
.
Rich
Yeah, wow. Yeah, yeah. Amazing, my God, so interesting.Yeah, yeah, definitely. And that I think that abarming smell is pretty strong. Cause I remember years ago when I did my apprenticeship, I did at New South Wales uni and our workshop was under the biomedical building. And right there, they had a morgue. And every time I'd walk past the morgue, there was the morgue attendant. He looked like a morgue attendant. He just had looked at you with open eyes, never blinked. And I remember stopping once and said,
.
Kat McCann
Yes.
.
Rich
Um, you know, how do you have any challenges? I don't know how you even do this job. Do you have anything that really, you know, that freaks you out about it? Because the only thing I hate is when people have got, uh, pins in their legs and then I've got to go through the bandsaw and I'm adding their legs up, you know? It's like, oh my God, but yeah, it's pretty crazy. But that smell was shocking. Um, but yeah, I can imagine. So that would have been really interesting. And then you started cosmetic tattooing and, um, and then you've been doing this now for many years, what have been some of the changes in the industry that you've seen that has been a big standout?
Kat McCann
I think, like, over the time, I suppose, I think, obviously, COVID was obviously a game changer in terms of, you know, education and delivery of content and information and that sort of real, I suppose, that connectivity of the industry. So you saw the exploding of online, on forums, on, you know, in like face to face, but on online education, I think that that was probably the biggest thing. So I suppose that really shifted that paragon in terms of that. And I think the fact that everyone was so connected and had all this time that they spent a lot more of it on online and connecting in those different ways. So that was certainly probably a big shift. And then that access to information and obviously conversations in forums and things about stuff that I suppose was not. or was safeguarded or wasn't necessarily spoken about as much until that kind of happened. So that was probably number one. And yeah, I would say that would probably be the biggest in terms of the way that people connected.
.
Rich
And even then, like since then, that's when we had the massive technology swing with regards to online training from COVID. So then a lot of people use that time to create more online content. So then more workshops are coming up online. And if you know, the more cosmetic tattoos are popping up and with bugger or training, and then now they're becoming trainers. And yeah, so it's been a massive explosion in the industry, but there's still the rock solid people that have been doing it for years have got loyal clientele and they're building their clientele from their work, you know, because their work speaks for themselves. So, oh, that's fantastic. And so how do you stay ahead of the trends in such like a dynamic field like Cosmic Tattooing?
Kat McCann
I suppose, like, I probably do things in a roundabout, back, backward, upside down way. But I mean, for me, I don't, I really don't do a lot of social media. I don't follow what people are doing. So in a sense that, you know, If I'm interested in something or if there's an appeal of something, it's usually got sort of like an educational context or an underpinning as to, you know, why I want to understand it. So I stay across a lot of the forums and I just sort of watch a lot. I don't necessarily contribute that much anymore. And it's not for any other reason other than, you know, just I suppose time. But in terms of staying ahead, I really I love all aspects of business. And I think, you know, when it comes to sort of tattooing or even running a tattooing business or evolving within an industry, one, you have to stay across all the different facets that impact that industry. But then there's also the external sort of ripples, I suppose, that then contribute to those factors. And so from a business perspective, business and strategy and governance and all that sort of stuff, which is kind of where I suppose my passion really sits, that's the stuff that sort of political or that geopolitical environment that it just opens up so many different avenues to be able to then cross that across into permanent makeup. And then you can really sort of explore those areas for me. That would probably be where I feel my progression would come. So yeah, not necessarily hands-on, but bigger, wider, you know, help other people's side of things. Yeah.
.
Rich
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you obviously specialize in corrections is your thing, your jam. So that's where you're really well known for. So that can be a lot of challenges to that and fixing other people's work, you know? Without mentioning any names or anything like that, well, people recommend it, recommend their own clients to you, you know? So, which is awesome where, you know, you've got other people other cosmetic tattooists recommending you to help them out, you know, which I think is really good.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, sorry. I was just gonna say on that basis, too, on that recommendation, I think it's really, it's such a valuable, I suppose, situation where people, you know, they do feel safe enough to reach out and feel like they can actually, you know, ask for assistance and not be judged or have that sort of ability to connect. Leverage off that connection to sort of say, oh look, I'm stuck or I've had this happen or anything like that. And then we're actually able to then sort of assist and transition through those sorts of things. Corrections are hard and client management is hard and all those things are all hard.
.
Rich
Yeah, that's fantastic. Now, and I understand something exciting, like you've won numerous awards. And so tell me when that first award you won. Tell me about it. And how did that impact you? How did you feel about it?
.
Kat McCan
I think every single time you go in for an award or at least you even put together a submission for an award, it's always scary because you're basically, you're really vulnerable, you're putting yourself out there. And a lot of the, like the types of awards that I've entered, I try to make sure that I can stay diverse in terms of not applying for the same awards all the time. I really, I loved the concept that it was open merit. It was judged by multiple different. So the first one probably 2017. And yeah, that was that was, you know, I suppose it was just a, you know, it was a it was a big warm hug in a sense that you think, oh gosh, you, you are by yourself a lot of the time. So to have that recognition, have that acknowledgement is huge. But yeah, scary at the same time, because you're like I said, you're putting yourself out there, but it also affirms that you can.
.
Rich
Yeah, so that first award, so that first award could have been very significant to you at that time, you know? And then recently last year, you got an awesome award as well. Tell us about that one.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, I decided because I pretty much sit in a room with no windows and draw on people or fix stuff up. It was about time that I put myself out there again. You know, I'd spent the last however many years on committees or part of associations and things. So obviously that means that you can't enter into anything like that. But I also think you're only as good as the work that you're putting out. And in terms of being able to stay cut, you also need to just benchmark yourself a little bit. So I suppose that was a motive, you know, by going into, and I think last year was like the Abacta or the Australian Beauty. I don't remember the Yakra, I mean, that one anyway, but we went and yeah, I was very, I was very, I suppose, I'm not gonna say lucky because there's no luck in it, but I was, I come out okay. So I took home about 30 boards, which was, Yeah, amazing. So, but it just, again, it just reaffirms that from a consistency perspective, that you kind of on the same track and you're doing OK. So that was really good.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, fantastic. That's awesome. And another thing I understand like you are, this year, 2024, you are going down a different direction. So you're gonna be focusing on education. So using your wealth of knowledge and experience and helping new people that wanna come into the industry. So tell us about what's the name of the academy and tell us about the type of students you're looking at putting on.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, so we have obviously our education arm will be through Inka Academy. And so the whole concept behind Inka is that not only do we, you know, we're able to sort of provide the fundamentals and things like that, but the whole, I suppose, what sort of sets us apart in that sense is that we're able to create a lot of pathway programs. And so the focus of where we sort of sit is a lot.You know, it's really around artists support. It's around being able to create, you know, industry short courses, which act as catalysts for artists, whether they're new or emerging or, you know, they're back doing a refresh. But it's to create these pathways where they can then articulate into the, you know, the higher education or the accredited education. And so being able to sort of, I suppose, have this makes it a different take on how people can achieve, obviously, that higher level of accreditation and then be able to sort of underpin that with context. And so, we've also got our emerging artists program as well, which basically, yeah, it's like a safety net program where they can work in clinic. And so we've got a couple of different avenues with the delivery modes and things like that. But yeah, it's a lot of a lot of is artist support.
.
Rich
Yeah, and what made you, what motivated you to do it, to open up the academy.
.
Kat McCann
I suppose I've always sort of focused a lot more on the post-grad side of things. And so it's, you know, that technical skill refinement or that sort of advanced sort of skill work. So the kind of technical stuff. And I guess, again, post-COVID, a lot of people had learnt online. There was a lot of movement in the groups where people weren't confident they'd done a lot of short courses or they'd done some courses and they just didn't necessarily have enough of a you know, a grasp on those fundamental concepts or the fact that they've done a whole bunch of training, but they still didn't feel like they were confident enough to work independently, you know, alone. So being able to, I guess, create something which is almost like a safety net for people, you know, just to sort of solidify those foundational skills was, yeah, probably the biggest factor to be able to sort of, you know, build something that would help, you know, bridge that gap.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And so, like, what skills do you think a lot of these learners, students need to really excel in the, to succeed in this industry? I know, obviously, the technical skills, but they need, obviously, other skills. And I think, obviously, the customer relationship skills, there's so much they need to be all rounded in to really, to make it, to work in this industry.
Kat McCann
Yeah. And you did right. I mean, like, there's so many factors. So it's not just a matter of, hey, I can tell you your eyebrows. It's about, you know, managing a business, managing your finances, having those core business fundamentals, in addition to, you know, how do you manage, you know, how do you manage client expectations if you've never done this? And a lot of the time, you know, there's a lot of scenarios where, unless you've been in the industry and you've learnt those little bits of knocks along the way or you know, how do you navigate things that you've never even come across in the first instance? So you don't know what you don't know. Um, and I think, you know, being a, those soft skills as well, they also then form, you know, part of, you know, the context that we're able to sort of deliver this type of education and stuff in. And, you know, and then it was, it's just the time, it's the healed results, it's the variability of your canvases and, you know, having the confidence to be able to make those informed choices and know why you do it. So, Yeah, we've really tried to sort of bring those practical skills into that delivery mode.
.
Rich
Yeah, yeah, definitely. Those healed results are so important as well, like, you know, for people that are actually doing it and not taking, waiting till they're healed and then take some photos and showing those instead of the fresh ones they do most of the time, which can change when they're healed, you know? So, no, that's awesome. So what are some of the challenges you faced in your career, like, to now, and then you've had to overcome those? Has there only been any major challenges? I know COVID was one, obviously, for a lot of us. Anything else in your?
Rich
Yeah, so that first award, so that first award could have been very significant to you at that time, you know? And then recently last year, you got an awesome award as well. Tell us about that one.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, I decided because I pretty much sit in a room with no windows and draw on people or fix stuff up. It was about time that I put myself out there again. You know, I'd spent the last however many years on committees or part of associations and things. So obviously that means that you can't enter into anything like that. But I also think you're only as good as the work that you're putting out. And in terms of being able to stay cut, you also need to just benchmark yourself a little bit. So I suppose that was a motive, you know, by going into, and I think last year was like the Abacta or the Australian Beauty. I don't remember the Yakra, I mean, that one anyway, but we went and yeah, I was very, I was very, I suppose, I'm not gonna say lucky because there's no luck in it, but I was, I come out okay. So I took home about 30 boards, which was, Yeah, amazing. So, but it just, again, it just reaffirms that from a consistency perspective, that you kind of on the same track and you're doing OK. So that was really good.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, fantastic. That's awesome. And another thing I understand like you are, this year, 2024, you are going down a different direction. So you're gonna be focusing on education. So using your wealth of knowledge and experience and helping new people that wanna come into the industry. So tell us about what's the name of the academy and tell us about the type of students you're looking at putting on.
.
Kat McCann
Yeah, so we have obviously our education arm will be through Inka Academy. And so the whole concept behind Inka is that not only do we, you know, we're able to sort of provide the fundamentals and things like that, but the whole, I suppose, what sort of sets us apart in that sense is that we're able to create a lot of pathway programs. And so the focus of where we sort of sit is a lot.You know, it's really around artists support. It's around being able to create, you know, industry short courses, which act as catalysts for artists, whether they're new or emerging or, you know, they're back doing a refresh. But it's to create these pathways where they can then articulate into the, you know, the higher education or the accredited education. And so being able to sort of, I suppose, have this makes it a different take on how people can achieve, obviously, that higher level of accreditation and then be able to sort of underpin that with context. And so, we've also got our emerging artists program as well, which basically, yeah, it's like a safety net program where they can work in clinic. And so we've got a couple of different avenues with the delivery modes and things like that. But yeah, it's a lot of a lot of is artist support.
.
Rich
Yeah, and what made you, what motivated you to do it, to open up the academy.
.
Kat McCann
I suppose I've always sort of focused a lot more on the post-grad side of things. And so it's, you know, that technical skill refinement or that sort of advanced sort of skill work. So the kind of technical stuff. And I guess, again, post-COVID, a lot of people had learnt online. There was a lot of movement in the groups where people weren't confident they'd done a lot of short courses or they'd done some courses and they just didn't necessarily have enough of a you know, a grasp on those fundamental concepts or the fact that they've done a whole bunch of training, but they still didn't feel like they were confident enough to work independently, you know, alone. So being able to, I guess, create something which is almost like a safety net for people, you know, just to sort of solidify those foundational skills was, yeah, probably the biggest factor to be able to sort of, you know, build something that would help, you know, bridge that gap.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And so, like, what skills do you think a lot of these learners, students need to really excel in the, to succeed in this industry? I know, obviously, the technical skills, but they need, obviously, other skills. And I think, obviously, the customer relationship skills, there's so much they need to be all rounded in to really, to make it, to work in this industry.
Kat McCann
Yeah. And you did right. I mean, like, there's so many factors. So it's not just a matter of, hey, I can tell you your eyebrows. It's about, you know, managing a business, managing your finances, having those core business fundamentals, in addition to, you know, how do you manage, you know, how do you manage client expectations if you've never done this? And a lot of the time, you know, there's a lot of scenarios where, unless you've been in the industry and you've learnt those little bits of knocks along the way or you know, how do you navigate things that you've never even come across in the first instance? So you don't know what you don't know. Um, and I think, you know, being a, those soft skills as well, they also then form, you know, part of, you know, the context that we're able to sort of deliver this type of education and stuff in. And, you know, and then it was, it's just the time, it's the healed results, it's the variability of your canvases and, you know, having the confidence to be able to make those informed choices and know why you do it. So, Yeah, we've really tried to sort of bring those practical skills into that delivery mode.
.
Rich
Yeah, yeah, definitely. Those healed results are so important as well, like, you know, for people that are actually doing it and not taking, waiting till they're healed and then take some photos and showing those instead of the fresh ones they do most of the time, which can change when they're healed, you know? So, no, that's awesome. So what are some of the challenges you faced in your career, like, to now, and then you've had to overcome those? Has there only been any major challenges? I know COVID was one, obviously, for a lot of us. Anything else in your?
.
Kat McCann
I actually loved COVID. I renovated my house and like I had a holiday, I felt like I could stop. The world just stood still so I wasn't getting left behind. But in saying that, look, challenge wise, I find technology is hard. I find putting myself out there is hard. Social media is hard. I find that's a really constant grind for me. Maybe I'm just old and it's not natural for me, but I really have to work at that. So that would probably be the biggest challenge. And then obviously so many components go into putting things together. Like you kind of think, Oh yeah, I'll just do this. And there's 550 components that go to making it up. And then you're worrying about, have I done enough? Have I forgotten something? Is there something that I could have done better? That's a massive challenge as well. I find that, yeah, just, just complexity of trying to do simple tasks. I challenge.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And now, and now looking back at your career, what are you most proud of?
.
Kat McCann
Um, I, I'm super stoked at the fact that I have had really amazing opportunities where I have obviously, you know, created some incredible friendships and alliances. And I feel, um, that I've been able to sort of, you know, build, build this incredible network of people who, you know, not only do they champion you, but they support you and they also lean on you without judgment and vice versa. And that for me would probably be the biggest achievement because you think you're not viewed as competition, you're actually viewed as an ally or an alliance. And that, that for me is probably the strongest thing that I'm the most proud of is because it's a safe, you know, it's a safe, it's a reliable, it's a loyal platform and you know, you've got all these amazing people that, you know, join you and stand up there and, you know, do all the same things. So I think that's pretty powerful.
.
Rich
Yeah, that's fantastic. No, that's awesome. And then one other question I wanna ask you is if you could take a piece of advice to your younger self when you were starting out, what advice would that be?
.
Kat McCann
I would say, look, I don't know. I think for me, I am so attention detail focused on stuff that I make sure I do everything to the nth degree. I would probably, I'd probably like, I don't know. I'm trying to think of something that I would, look, I probably wouldn't change anything on myself, but I would say if anybody gets news coming in, don't take shortcuts, you know, invest in people you
work with, you absolutely love investing the proper stuff up front. Don't cut corners because Conners will always, you know, they'll always come back to bite you around the corner. And yeah, keep your integrity intact and yeah, do the right thing.
.
Rich
And one of the things I think is you'd rather spend more money as a learner, you know, and it doesn't matter what it is, and working with someone is the best in what they do. So you spend more money, but you're working with someone who's got the experience and the credibility, and then focusing on, oh, this is cheap, I'll just do this. Because the outcome, you end up redoing things again or getting retrained again. And I see this so many times. So focus on the best, you know. Talk to the best and that's the only way you're going to learn. And so I think that's really important. So yeah, looking at for our listeners and what if you're like anyone aspiring to be a cosmetic tattooist, what steps should they take to get into it?
.
Kat McCann
Well, I would definitely say find an artist who you resonate with, find an artist who is out there and doing things, someone that's in alliance with where you would like to be. I mean, even now, like I look at it and go, right, what are people doing that I wish to be able to do into the future? And I go and, you know, put myself in front of those people and most people that are out there doing stuff will absolutely love the fact that you've got somebody that's enthusiastic and willing and, you know, hungry to be able to succeed. And so, you know, I mean, I'm that person, hey, I'll wash your car for free, I'll do this, I'll do that, whatever the case is, I don't care what it looks like, get and do it and get in front of those people. Because if they've already been out there and they're doing it, they're going to shortcut a million knocks in the road that you would otherwise have to just find yourself if you've got
somebody that can gently guide you or at least maintain that level of energy so that you can maintain that you know yourself and then you continue to be inspired and then they challenge you and think big like don't ever just you know don't give your ideas to someone that will tell you oh you know this is not good or this is not bad or whatever the case is you stay true to what you want to do and yeah push hard and go hard on that
.
Rich
Yeah, awesome. Now, a little birdie told me you're going to be having an event later in the year in Bali. It's going to be like a PMU retreat. So tell me a little bit about that.
.
Kat McCann
Mm-hmm. Yeah, of course. So one of the, I suppose we touched a little bit briefly just on with respect to artists' support. And that's probably one of the most exciting projects that we've got with INCA is that we've got our INCA Island retreat. So we've got the series of retreats across Bali, Vanuatu and Fiji. And so they are really designed to have this wonderful fusion of professional development, we've got some business elements in there, we've got relaxation and sort of spa side of things. So people can sort of meet people from all over the world and really sort of create that support network and base. And then obviously we've got some incredible artists as well that will be coming in. And there's technique and there's unprecedented access to really strong artists that have this wealth of information. So we've kind of tried to get that and then meld that into these incredible programs over a seven-day period. And I think the biggest thing for us is that, yeah, that they're budget-focused and so, you know, maximum value for money and then it's not, there's something that is achievable for, you know, your sort of early career artists, newer artists or obviously those that are looking to be able to come and refresh as well. So lots in store.
.
Rich
Kat McCann
I actually loved COVID. I renovated my house and like I had a holiday, I felt like I could stop. The world just stood still so I wasn't getting left behind. But in saying that, look, challenge wise, I find technology is hard. I find putting myself out there is hard. Social media is hard. I find that's a really constant grind for me. Maybe I'm just old and it's not natural for me, but I really have to work at that. So that would probably be the biggest challenge. And then obviously so many components go into putting things together. Like you kind of think, Oh yeah, I'll just do this. And there's 550 components that go to making it up. And then you're worrying about, have I done enough? Have I forgotten something? Is there something that I could have done better? That's a massive challenge as well. I find that, yeah, just, just complexity of trying to do simple tasks. I challenge.
.
Rich
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And now, and now looking back at your career, what are you most proud of?
.
Kat McCann
Um, I, I'm super stoked at the fact that I have had really amazing opportunities where I have obviously, you know, created some incredible friendships and alliances. And I feel, um, that I've been able to sort of, you know, build, build this incredible network of people who, you know, not only do they champion you, but they support you and they also lean on you without judgment and vice versa. And that for me would probably be the biggest achievement because you think you're not viewed as competition, you're actually viewed as an ally or an alliance. And that, that for me is probably the strongest thing that I'm the most proud of is because it's a safe, you know, it's a safe, it's a reliable, it's a loyal platform and you know, you've got all these amazing people that, you know, join you and stand up there and, you know, do all the same things. So I think that's pretty powerful.
.
Rich
Yeah, that's fantastic. No, that's awesome. And then one other question I wanna ask you is if you could take a piece of advice to your younger self when you were starting out, what advice would that be?
.
Kat McCann
I would say, look, I don't know. I think for me, I am so attention detail focused on stuff that I make sure I do everything to the nth degree. I would probably, I'd probably like, I don't know. I'm trying to think of something that I would, look, I probably wouldn't change anything on myself, but I would say if anybody gets news coming in, don't take shortcuts, you know, invest in people you
work with, you absolutely love investing the proper stuff up front. Don't cut corners because Conners will always, you know, they'll always come back to bite you around the corner. And yeah, keep your integrity intact and yeah, do the right thing.
.
Rich
And one of the things I think is you'd rather spend more money as a learner, you know, and it doesn't matter what it is, and working with someone is the best in what they do. So you spend more money, but you're working with someone who's got the experience and the credibility, and then focusing on, oh, this is cheap, I'll just do this. Because the outcome, you end up redoing things again or getting retrained again. And I see this so many times. So focus on the best, you know. Talk to the best and that's the only way you're going to learn. And so I think that's really important. So yeah, looking at for our listeners and what if you're like anyone aspiring to be a cosmetic tattooist, what steps should they take to get into it?
.
Kat McCann
Well, I would definitely say find an artist who you resonate with, find an artist who is out there and doing things, someone that's in alliance with where you would like to be. I mean, even now, like I look at it and go, right, what are people doing that I wish to be able to do into the future? And I go and, you know, put myself in front of those people and most people that are out there doing stuff will absolutely love the fact that you've got somebody that's enthusiastic and willing and, you know, hungry to be able to succeed. And so, you know, I mean, I'm that person, hey, I'll wash your car for free, I'll do this, I'll do that, whatever the case is, I don't care what it looks like, get and do it and get in front of those people. Because if they've already been out there and they're doing it, they're going to shortcut a million knocks in the road that you would otherwise have to just find yourself if you've got
somebody that can gently guide you or at least maintain that level of energy so that you can maintain that you know yourself and then you continue to be inspired and then they challenge you and think big like don't ever just you know don't give your ideas to someone that will tell you oh you know this is not good or this is not bad or whatever the case is you stay true to what you want to do and yeah push hard and go hard on that
.
Rich
Yeah, awesome. Now, a little birdie told me you're going to be having an event later in the year in Bali. It's going to be like a PMU retreat. So tell me a little bit about that.
.
Kat McCann
Mm-hmm. Yeah, of course. So one of the, I suppose we touched a little bit briefly just on with respect to artists' support. And that's probably one of the most exciting projects that we've got with INCA is that we've got our INCA Island retreat. So we've got the series of retreats across Bali, Vanuatu and Fiji. And so they are really designed to have this wonderful fusion of professional development, we've got some business elements in there, we've got relaxation and sort of spa side of things. So people can sort of meet people from all over the world and really sort of create that support network and base. And then obviously we've got some incredible artists as well that will be coming in. And there's technique and there's unprecedented access to really strong artists that have this wealth of information. So we've kind of tried to get that and then meld that into these incredible programs over a seven-day period. And I think the biggest thing for us is that, yeah, that they're budget-focused and so, you know, maximum value for money and then it's not, there's something that is achievable for, you know, your sort of early career artists, newer artists or obviously those that are looking to be able to come and refresh as well. So lots in store.
.
Rich
And how many people are you expecting at that event?
.
Kat McCann
Yep. I believe we've placed it at 20. So the way that this sort of programs structure. Yeah. So it's structured in a way that you really do have, you know, a lot of information to fit into that whole time. But we've tried to, you know, sort of structure it in a way that, yeah, you've got that maximum rest, rejuve, plus obviously that recalibration through your business and there's going to have some really good tangible outcomes.
.
Rich
Wow, that's fantastic. How exciting. And I just wanted to say also congratulations on your wedding and you're off tomorrow to Vietnam, which is so exciting. So, and now before we wrap up, I just wanted to say if people wanted to find out about your academy and your training, I will obviously add a link on here for them as well.
.
Kat McCann
Yep. I believe we've placed it at 20. So the way that this sort of programs structure. Yeah. So it's structured in a way that you really do have, you know, a lot of information to fit into that whole time. But we've tried to, you know, sort of structure it in a way that, yeah, you've got that maximum rest, rejuve, plus obviously that recalibration through your business and there's going to have some really good tangible outcomes.
.
Rich
Wow, that's fantastic. How exciting. And I just wanted to say also congratulations on your wedding and you're off tomorrow to Vietnam, which is so exciting. So, and now before we wrap up, I just wanted to say if people wanted to find out about your academy and your training, I will obviously add a link on here for them as well.
.
Kat McCann
Thank you! I am!
Kat McCann
Thank you! I am!
.
Rich
Yeah, no worries. Thanks so much, Kat, for coming on. And hopefully you'll be back on again sometime later in the year with some other news and other changes or whatever is happening. So, no, it's awesome. Thanks so much for joining us today. I appreciate it.
Yeah, no worries. Thanks so much, Kat, for coming on. And hopefully you'll be back on again sometime later in the year with some other news and other changes or whatever is happening. So, no, it's awesome. Thanks so much for joining us today. I appreciate it.
